Tuesday, September 4, 2012

Would It Still Work?



On my post, a Word From Blue,  Lillie asked a question in the comment section that has been on my mind every since. She asked Blue if he thought DD could work without the physical element. In other words, do you really have to spank?  I am referring to real punishment spankings, not the more fun kind.......:)




I realize that the second "D" stands for discipline, but does it really have to be physical? There are lots of options. Writing lines, loss of privileges, grounding, etc...




Blue thinks it is possible for some people to have a successful DD style relationship without spanking. He was thinking of his own parents. While he was growing up, there was no doubt at all who The Boss of the household was. What his dad said went, no questions asked. Blue and his siblings were expected to "mind" him or suffer the consequences. That included getting a whipping, as he called it. His dad also believed in being sent to your room and being grounded. Blue's mom also submitted to her husband's authority.  Blue can't think of a single time his mom went against what his dad said. His dad was/is a very strong HoH, yet I'm sure if I called him one, he would not have a clue what I meant by it. I'm also quite confident that Blue's dad has never spanked his mom. It's so unlikely, I can't seriously consider the possibility. Blue's parents have already celebrated their 50th anniversary.




I know in the beginning of our DD journey, before Blue ever spanked me, my change in behavior had a huge beneficial effect on our relationship. Could I have kept it up without any other incentive? Namely, to save my butt from feeling the fire.....Honestly, I don't know. I think I could have and would have to some extent, but.....I guess my own opinion is mixed. Yes, I think it could still work for us without punishment spanking, just not nearly as well!




What do you think?  Could/Would you still be submissive without punishment spanking? Is it optional or a must have for your relationship?


50 comments:

  1. We have only been at this whole DD thing since March-ish. I began living and treating my husband as if we were doing DD before I ever told him what it was. When I finally bit the bullet and explained the whole thing to him, he said he did not think he could ever spank me ;) So, yes we tried...but eventually found that my good nature ran out, and I needed an incentive to keep going. At first, he tried taking away the computer and such.....but then one day he looked at me and said that he thought that he needed to start spanking me. Yes, I was scared...but I cannot argue with the results. Our marriage before and after DD simply cannot be denied. We have always had a good marriage....but now it is great. He has also recently been putting me in the corner.....that is just terrible. The first time he sent me there I thought I would die. Anyway, could it work for some? Absolutely! For us? No! Spanking is a way to end disagreements that otherwise would be unchecked, a way to get my attitude and respect in the right place. We have grown so much. Yes, I am held accountable for certain things, but he holds himself to the same high standards....that is why it works so well.

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    1. Hi Lucy, and welcome! We have a lot in common. My husband, Blue and I started DD for real mid-March and I started it exactly in the way you described. I asked for that first spanking though. It was pretty scary/weird the first time, I know. I couldn't agree more, the results are nothing short of miraculous! I also like the way a spanking wipes the slate clean and we can both just put the issue behind us, (pun not intended,lol).
      It is great how the whole dynamic works. The HoH holds you accountable, but at the same time holds himself to an even higher standard.

      Thank you so much for taking the time to share your personal experience and insight! :)

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  2. Hi CG. I thought I would reply to your question although I have virtually no experience with spanking and very little with dd. this past month I have been trying to treat Moose as the HoH. Even without the discipline I can already see some pretty significant benefits in our lives.

    I am treating him better and as a result he is treating me better. Sex has never been better...well at least for the last decade. He is actually helping me more around the house. (we both work so this is an unexpected blessing.). If I mention something I want to get done then he jumps right in and helps. On the flip side I am trying very hard to make sure we have supper as a family and make our home a place he wants to be.

    Another bonus has been that our teenager is toned down her sarcastic remarks...sadly she inherited that from her mother. :). She also says its gross that we go along holding hands and such, but I know she likes it better than the indifference we treated each other in the past.

    I think some of our rules will slide without spanking (I still haven't lost a single pound...partly because we have really good suppers now.). And I am tempted to snap at him if I'm feeling grumpy. But the benefits have been so good that I would hate to go back to he way we were.

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    1. Hello, He's the Boss :) I'm so happy that you decided to comment. I think you're selling yourself short. It sounds like you do have more than a little experience with living DD. Treating each other better is at the very core of why we live with this dynamic. It sounds like you two are doing just great! I love that even your teen-aged daughter has changed her behavior too. Lol, her remark that seeing you hold hands is gross! She would never admit it, but I bet she loves to see that!

      Thank you for sharing your story with us. I think your story is most likely going to be a source of inspiraton for several others. Keep up the good work, I think you'll get exactly what you're hoping for in time. :)

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  3. Cowgirl, really interesting subject. Cael and I have done DD without the physical element. We started off with spanking as a part of it, but he found it to be too forced and too cumbersome, so he said he still expected me to do what he said, but he wasn't going to use spanking as a tool. It worked, but it wasn't easy either. It's not that I had to be spanked into submission, but more that there were still times I wanted that extra guidance. I found that submitting in other ways helped my mindset -- ie, doing things he'd want me to do before he even asked. Eventually spanking crept its way back into our relationship and right now we're sort of a mix. Spanking for punishment is a very rare thing, but we both know it exists, just in case.

    Interesting that Blue's parents had a similar dynamic, is that why you do DD with him or was it your idea to do it?

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    1. Hi Riley :) Your story is pretty interesting. You've done it both ways and have settled into the right mix that works for both of you. Sounds pretty smart. I'm thinking that this lifestyle will be evolving for us for a long time.

      This lifestyle was my idea. I think Blue probably does get a lot of his inspiration from his dad though. Since he experienced corporal punishment growing up, he does understand what a belt feels like at least....

      Thanks for sharing, Riley!

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  4. Hey CG - To spank or not to spank - that is A question. :) Unfortunately for my tush, I do better with spanking. :(

    In general, I think it is like every other punishment within a DD relationship - specific to that relationship. Some can do very well without any spanking, others don't do corner time, grounding, etc.

    Take care,
    Cat

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    1. Hey Cat, very clever :) It's A question, not THE question, lol! I think, like you, I do better with spanking as an incentive. True, it's a very individual decision. The best thing about DD is it's ability to adapt to whatever works best for you and your partner.

      Thanks for adding your comments, Cat. I always enjoyed reading your insights on LDD, I'm really happy you decided to come see me here. You take care yourself as well! :)

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  5. Can't answer this question. Interesting though to get other's perspectives.

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    1. Hi Sunnygirl! Thanks for stopping by :). I find others' perspectives fascinating, and I usually learn a lot too.

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  6. Very interesting question Cowgirl. For us, DD would NOT function at ALL really without spanking. We've been trying to make this work long distance with a lot of the spanking alternatives and we both know they don't work for us nearly as well. So, nope...it wouldn't still work. :)

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    1. So, I'll put you down for a definite NO WAY, lol! You certainly have enough experience doing DD without the physical aspect, so I respect your opinion. I wonder if one day soon, you'll look back on this distance thing with longing :) Thanks Molly Rose, for sharing with us!

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  7. Hi CG :)
    This is an interesting topic for me because, when we started Dd, Ian was hung up on the idea that I should be able to be obedient without the application of physical punishment. His thought was, "if you truly have a desire to submit, then submitting without force or consequence should be possible."
    Now, he spanks for broken rules and that is that.
    I am better (not necessarily happier) when there is a physical consequence, or I drift into the behaviours and attitudes that had corroded our marriage for decades.
    I thought it was really nice that Blue was confident in your marriage on any terms. He sounds like the Rock of Gibraltar. :)
    I look forward to a day when that is a reality for Ian and I - but it is not right now.
    When and I were struggling with this issue at the beginning, a commenter on Mick's blog told me that my "love language" required a physical component. I thought about that a great deal, and still do. Also, because I had never had physical discipline in my life, until now, I had no perception of the reality of physical consequences. Ian, who was raised in a loving family with spanking, had a reference - and therefore understood it.

    Nice that you made it a post, CG - I found everybody's comments really interesting. :)

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    1. Hi there, Lillie :) Until you actually start living DD, it does seem like we should be able to submit just because we want to. It just isn't that easy for some of us, I agree! Blue is more confident in me than I am. I know what you mean about drifting. I think that left to my own devices, I would slowly, but surely drift back into bad habits. Not as bad as before, true, but still,it would be a step back. Blue's going to get a kick out of being called the Rock of Gibraltar, lol! He'll love it!
      That commenter on Mick's blog sounds like one smart cookie, and what a beautiful way with words. Does that person have a blog?

      Thanks for taking the time to share your personal experience, Lillie. Not to mention, asking that question of Blue in the first place. You started a fascinating discussion! :)

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    2. Hi CG!
      I had to go back and look it up, and they posted under the name of Palamino, with no blog. I remembered her (I am sure it is a woman) take on things very well.
      I tried to put in here in the comments, but it was too long to fit, so it is under July of this year on Mick's site, in the Questions from Lillian post, if anyone is interested.

      Delete
    3. Hi Lillie :) Thanks for going back to look that up, I am interested. Think I'll go on over and check it out. That name does sound a little familiar.....

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  8. Yes, very interesting post. We don't do punishment spankings, so I can't offer an opinion, but love reading the answers...

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    1. Thanks for stopping by, Renee Rose! I love reading everyone's insights and opinions too. :)

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  9. I agree with all the above about this being an interesting post. Since I am not in a traditional DD relationship then I am going to answer yes to this. I only know that since I started reading DD blogs a year ago now that my own midset has changed so much. I want to be more submissive, loving, and strive for the best in my marriage. And, spanking has helped in that regard as well as just the tenants of DD relationship. But, I will go as far to admit that I think it would be more benefical to have punishment spankings in a true DD relationship to be the most effective. Regards,

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    1. Hello, SNP :) I agree, just following the basic principles of DD can make a huge difference in your relationship even without spanking. Spanking does help reinforce the whole mindset I think.It's wonderful that you're striving for the very best for your marriage. I'm thinking that your husband knows that he is one lucky man!

      Thank you so much for sharing your experiences, I appreciate it :)

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  10. Yes, I think it would be possible and I'm guessing that there will be a time when because of illness etc we won't be able to spank. I would hope that our dynamic will be so thoroughly entrenched that we could carry on without the physical component.

    That said, it's a huge part of this for us and I don't think we'd give up the physicality without a fight. I like what Lillie said about her love language requiring a physical component. I think I'm similar. I got spanked last night for breaking a rule and I needed the closure that it gave me. I can't see anything else (like writing lines etc) giving me that same closure.

    All that to say that spanking is at the core of "how" we do this but it isn't the core itself. Our dynamic isn't fully dependent on it, nor our commitment to each other to pursue ttwd...but it sure plays a central role.

    Clearly I need more coffee. I hope that made a little sense.

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    1. Hi Susie :) Yes, that made perfect sense. I have wondered what some would do in case of an illness/disability of some kind that would take spanking off the table. If the dynamic is totally dependent on spanking, I see big problems ahead.

      I couldn't agree more about the closure from a spanking, that was the first benefit Blue and I noticed and appreciated.

      Thank you for your input, Susie. You made some excellent points to consider! :)

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  11. Very interesting topic. Yes, I think DD could work without punishment spankings but I am not sure it would work as effectively, or that it would work for all couples. I agree with Cat, I think it is something specific to each relationship.

    For us, I tend to feel more resolved and centered with spanking than other punishments, and I think without it old behaviours would creep back in and more rules would be broken.

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    1. Hello Roz, and welcome! Happy to see you here :) I absolutely agree with your view of spanking. I do think old behaviors would slowly , but surely creep back in. Still, for all those who don't/can't spank just following the basic principles of DD would still reap some pretty big benefits.

      Thanks for taking the time to comment and share you own experiences! :)

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  12. I believe that everyone can and should be able to do it their way. Since we don't do DD I am certainly not an expert. My parents had/ have a very traditional marriage. My mother would often say that my father made the final decision. That being said,If she felt strongly about something there was no way my father would insist she acquiesce. I know there was certainly no punishment spanking, since we were 7 or 9 in a smallish home. Oh, aside from the playful stuff we all saw. To this day they kiss good- by even if my father is just leaving for a walk or going the grocery store.

    One of the definitions of discipline states: A state of order based upon submission to rules and authority.However many of the definitions do speak to the punishment and training component.

    I think everyone should decide together in their marriage. If the couple wants/ needs discipline for it to be successful, then do it. If they want to do DD without- do it. Everyone is different there are so many variables.

    Not sure if my opinion matters since I am part of the ttwd world. But I certainly would say respect is part of any good marriage. That is one of the big tenets of the four d's.

    Love hearing everyone's thoughts. Great topic.


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    1. Hi Minelle :) Your parents sound like very smart people, much like Blue's parents. That's so sweet they still show each other affection. We make it a point to always kiss goodbye/hello. I would feel lost if Blue didn't hold my hand everytime we were out walking anywhere.

      Of course your opinion matters, and I'm so happy you took the time to share yours! I think TTWD is a very close relative of DD anyway. I agree, it is a very personal decision and everyone will have to decide what works best for them. Respect, or lack of, is IMHO the biggest one of the four D's.

      Thanks Minelle :)

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  13. Well I think if both people want it, it is definitely possible. I think I have gotten one punishment spanking, that is it. And not because DH isn't paying attention, but more because I already do everything he cares about. I care about the same things, so I don't need to do anything I don't want to. DH's rules are sensible, there is a reason why he made them a rule. So I think it is possible.

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    1. Hi Julia :) Wow, only one punishment spanking! I'm impressed. You guys are definitely doing something right. I think you just gave several people hope that a great relationship is entirely possible without punishment spankings. Thank you so much for taking the time to comment!

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  14. There are two questions here:

    Can dd work without punishment spankings, or can you have a dd-style relationship without punishment spankings?

    Could/would you be submissive without punishment spankings?

    The same questions, sort of, but kinda not. The answer(s) are simple and very complex.

    Yes, to the first. Entirely possible, absolutely. Degree of effectiveness depends on many things.

    Yes to the second question, if you are a submissive - it's in your nature. Yes, again, even if you are not a submissive or do not have a submissive nature, if you choose to be submissive to your leader. Again, degree of effectiveness depends on many things.

    Some things to consider that make this very simple, or complex by degree, and can make your head spin:

    Is submission difficult for you, or do you crave it, thrive on it? How much do you trust your leader to protect and serve you? How much of yourself are you willing to devote? How self-aware are you? How committed are you? Does your leader place your needs above his own, love you sacrificially? How important are these things, or other things to you? What if your leader couldn't lead you, or enforce punishment, due to injury or illness (yours or his) - would you still submit?

    Our dynamic is...every bit as complicated as everybody else's whose is complicated. This relationship business should not be so complicated! It should be simple, easy. I want that "perfect" button. Not so I can push it and we're automatically perfect. I like working through things, communicating, achieving milestones and accomplishing goals through my efforts. I want to push the button to prevent hurtful mistakes along the way. I really hate to see him hurt, or confused, or totally confounded by my feelings, wants, needs. Ugh.

    Irishey

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    1. Well said, my friend, Irishey.....well said. :)
      Very thought provoking.

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    2. Hi Irishey, glad to see you :) Dang, are you really going to make me think that hard! My poor head is a spinning!

      Seriously, you have come up with a great list of questions. I think they could really help someone clarify things in their own mind by going through them and giving an honest answer. Your insights really cut through the clutter and get right to the heart of the matter. I'll be thinking about my own answers to those questions for a good long time.

      A perfect button would be wonderful. I like that you wouldn't push it to be automatically perfect, but would use it to spare your partner hurt. That says a lot about you. All good things! I know what you mean, I would rather be hurt myself than see a loved one suffer. Maybe it's a good thing relationship are so complicated. The things you have to work for are always so much more valued and appreciated.

      Thank you so much for taking the time to offer such a well thought out and thought provoking comment! I appreciate you, Irishey :)

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    3. I agree, Lillie. Irishey is always spot on!

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  15. Great question. We started with spankings before we started dd, so the spanking came naturally while the submission was a little more difficult. Because I have seen the difference in our relationship now that I don't argue with him and he has the official role of being the HoH, I don't think I would need a spanking. But I would rather not chance it right now.

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    1. Hi Blondie, good to see you :) It's great that you think it would work for you without you having to be spanked. I think that should be the ultimate goal.I think that for all of us, sooner or later spanking won't be an option. But, I get what you're saying. If it ain't broke, don't fix it! Thanks for sharing your personal experiences, Blondie :)

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  16. hello! My fiance and I started DD early april, and at first, he didn't want to spank me either, and if he did it wasn't a true punishment spanking. However, now that he is being much more consistent it's working out much better, and I honestly couldn't imagine it without the spanking.

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    1. Hello Rachel! Welcome :) I think a lot of the guys have trouble in the beginning giving a true punishment spanking. They seem to pick it pretty quickly though, lol. I'm happy to hear that things are going so well for you and your fiance. You'll start your marriage off on such a strong foundation! Thank you so much for visiting my blog and taking the time to comment. Congratulations on your upcoming marriage too! :)

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  17. This has been a great question and I like reading the answers.

    For some couples, I can see how that would work. For our dynamic, I don't see us growing and progressing in the way that we have, without spanking as discipline. I don't like to obey, and I need to be motivated. Spanking is something to avoid. I am not naturally submissive, so sometimes I simply have to be "put there" before I find my submissive mindset, and he is happy to do it, to put me in a position where its obvious I'm his, and he is my authority, and I had better listen.

    I am very fiery, and there are many times when I am stopped in my tracks by being suddenly thrown otk..and it certainly is effective in that he is in charge and I'm reminded abruptly. I also quickly remember that I am submissive, and I need to get back on track.

    I tend to pull away, and if I'm in trouble even more so...so being sent to write lines would afford me even more of a chance to draw into myself. A spanking ends with me in tears, in his arms, being forgiven and having a chance to cry it out, and talk it out.

    My husband enjoys the dominance and discipline aspect of this lifestyle. While he isn't cruel or sadistic he appreciates the physical and sexual aspect of spanking his woman, and it enforces our roles we have agreed to hold within our marriage. Its a tangible reminder too of his job as protector and leader, he literally has me in his hands, and all the trust that implies.

    Its a formal ritual of closure and resolution..and when its over, the issue is over. We both appreciate this about ttwd, because we close the door on whatever came between us and start each small conflict (or large!) with a fresh outlook and no leftover bitterness or misunderstandings.

    IF there was anything else that worked the same, I'd be an advocate of it, I am sure. With everything about us, our unique way of interacting as a couple, and our two personalities..this is the "forever" way for us.

    I can't speak for anyone else, but for us..its the way it will be.

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    1. Hi Stormy :) I have greatly enjoyed reading all these wonderful answers. Lillie really started a fascinating discussion with her post comment!

      I've read your blog often enough that no, I couldn't imagine you and your Ogre not spanking. You express so beautifully in your posts (and here), how well spanking works for you both and for your marriage.

      I agree with your feelings on writing lines. I haven't done it, but I think that doing so would just make me feel more distant. I also love how a spanking leads to being comforted and that feeling of extreme closeness.

      Thank you for adding your personal experiences. Your comment is just as well written as your blog. I appreciate you sharing with us here today. :)

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  18. Hi Cowgirl! Since we just started ttwd, I haven't had any punishment spankings. I do however believe that when it occurs, it will make a big difference in how I behave. We've been doing a lot of erotic and stress relief spanking which has made a huge difference in how I feel and how close we've become. As for your question, I am naturally submissive. I think there are personalities that are and those that aren't. Spanking would be more of a motivator for me. It would make sure I stay on top of what I need to get done and I would stop being so lazy. So I guess we'll cross that bridge when we get to it!

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  19. Hi lilmisses! I know what you mean, erotic and stress relief spankings are so effective at bringing such intimacy and closeness! I love them for just that reason. There's not one fun thing about punishment spankings though. I guess that's the point. Your being naturally submissive is such a blessing for your husband I bet. It might save you a lot of trouble (pain) too someday...
    I really doubt that you're lazy, lilmisses. I'm sure you're just being too hard on yourself :) Thanks for commenting!

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